Comments on: Greg Boyd Explain’s His Open Theism http://marcdav.wordpress.com/2006/08/28/greg-boyd-explains-his-open-theism/ Reflections on the biblical themes of Shabbat, Pentecost, Jubilee, and how they relate to Jesus' Kingdom, and whatever strikes my fancy Thu, 03 Jul 2008 23:09:06 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=MU By: Sam Conner http://marcdav.wordpress.com/2006/08/28/greg-boyd-explains-his-open-theism/#comment-7441 Sam Conner Wed, 23 Apr 2008 02:04:54 +0000 https://marcdav.wordpress.com/2006/08/28/greg-boyd-explains-his-open-theism/#comment-7441 I think that there may still be a fundamental problem with Pastor Boyd's position. If God knows the future only as "possibility" until it actually happens, then that implies that God has to learn from the creation what actually happens in it. God's knowledge of history (what has actually happened) seems, in this view, to be radically dependent on something outside Himself (that is, God's knowledge of the world is dependent on the world). This seems a worrisome limitation on God and an excessive imputation of autonomy to the world. A view that seems better to me is that God's knowledge of the created world is rooted in His knowledge of His own will for what the creation is to be. This concept is encapsulated in the Reformed doctrine of God's decree. This disagreement is closely parallel to the disagreement between the Arminian and Calvinist understandings of soteriology. I think that there may still be a fundamental problem with Pastor Boyd’s position. If God knows the future only as “possibility” until it actually happens, then that implies that God has to learn from the creation what actually happens in it. God’s knowledge of history (what has actually happened) seems, in this view, to be radically dependent on something outside Himself (that is, God’s knowledge of the world is dependent on the world). This seems a worrisome limitation on God and an excessive imputation of autonomy to the world.

A view that seems better to me is that God’s knowledge of the created world is rooted in His knowledge of His own will for what the creation is to be. This concept is encapsulated in the Reformed doctrine of God’s decree.

This disagreement is closely parallel to the disagreement between the Arminian and Calvinist understandings of soteriology.

]]> By: paul http://marcdav.wordpress.com/2006/08/28/greg-boyd-explains-his-open-theism/#comment-7375 paul Wed, 09 Jan 2008 16:45:08 +0000 https://marcdav.wordpress.com/2006/08/28/greg-boyd-explains-his-open-theism/#comment-7375 More from me just to clear up further ,,, I read Greg Boyd's letter and have a simple question ,, Does God know anything in its certainty ??? Does He know for certain what will happen,,, if He does then this closes the system ( from his standpoint) and all the possibilities are rendered as theoretical,, if on the other hand He does not,,, then He knows only possibilities and therefore omniscience takes on a different meaning . More from me just to clear up further ,,, I read Greg Boyd’s letter and have a simple question ,, Does God know anything in its certainty ??? Does He know for certain what will happen,,, if He does then this closes the system ( from his standpoint) and all the possibilities are rendered as theoretical,, if on the other hand He does not,,, then He knows only possibilities and therefore omniscience takes on a different meaning .

]]> By: paul http://marcdav.wordpress.com/2006/08/28/greg-boyd-explains-his-open-theism/#comment-7003 paul Fri, 23 Nov 2007 19:25:27 +0000 https://marcdav.wordpress.com/2006/08/28/greg-boyd-explains-his-open-theism/#comment-7003 sorry the reference is 1 Sam 23 :10-13 10Then said David, O LORD God of Israel, thy servant hath certainly heard that Saul seeketh to come to Keilah, to destroy the city for my sake. 11Will the men of Keilah deliver me up into his hand? will Saul come down, as thy servant hath heard? O LORD God of Israel, I beseech thee, tell thy servant. And the LORD said, He will come down. 12Then said David, Will the men of Keilah deliver me and my men into the hand of Saul? And the LORD said, They will deliver thee up. 13Then David and his men, which were about six hundred, arose and departed out of Keilah, and went whithersoever they could go. And it was told Saul that David was escaped from Keilah; and he forbare to go forth. sorry the reference is 1 Sam 23 :10-13

10Then said David, O LORD God of Israel, thy servant hath certainly heard that Saul seeketh to come to Keilah, to destroy the city for my sake.

11Will the men of Keilah deliver me up into his hand? will Saul come down, as thy servant hath heard? O LORD God of Israel, I beseech thee, tell thy servant. And the LORD said, He will come down.

12Then said David, Will the men of Keilah deliver me and my men into the hand of Saul? And the LORD said, They will deliver thee up.

13Then David and his men, which were about six hundred, arose and departed out of Keilah, and went whithersoever they could go. And it was told Saul that David was escaped from Keilah; and he forbare to go forth.

]]> By: paul http://marcdav.wordpress.com/2006/08/28/greg-boyd-explains-his-open-theism/#comment-7002 paul Fri, 23 Nov 2007 19:16:40 +0000 https://marcdav.wordpress.com/2006/08/28/greg-boyd-explains-his-open-theism/#comment-7002 OK Boyd's explanation is clear ,,,,the God of possibilities is indeed biblical see 1Sam 10:12 ,, however God is still knowing of the eventual course of events and therefore knows all things in their finite path ,,, My thoughts therefore are more in terms of ,,,what purpose can come of pretending an infinite set of choices when only one will take place? ,,,it seems that no matter how open one wishes to be it eventually ends up being quite closed. OK Boyd’s explanation is clear ,,,,the God of possibilities is indeed biblical see
1Sam 10:12 ,, however God is still knowing of the eventual course of events and therefore knows all things in their finite path ,,,

My thoughts therefore are more in terms of ,,,what purpose can come of pretending an infinite set of choices when only one will take place? ,,,it seems that no matter how open one wishes to be it eventually ends up being quite closed.

]]> By: marcdav http://marcdav.wordpress.com/2006/08/28/greg-boyd-explains-his-open-theism/#comment-457 marcdav Tue, 20 Feb 2007 23:50:01 +0000 https://marcdav.wordpress.com/2006/08/28/greg-boyd-explains-his-open-theism/#comment-457 Yeah, if you are a hardcore Calvinist, his comments will not satisfy you, but I don't think that you can really see Greg as being unbiblical or a heretic after reading his letter. Yeah, if you are a hardcore Calvinist, his comments will not satisfy you, but I don’t think that you can really see Greg as being unbiblical or a heretic after reading his letter.

]]> By: Lon http://marcdav.wordpress.com/2006/08/28/greg-boyd-explains-his-open-theism/#comment-455 Lon Tue, 20 Feb 2007 22:54:14 +0000 https://marcdav.wordpress.com/2006/08/28/greg-boyd-explains-his-open-theism/#comment-455 I had the same questions of him, and just finished reading the document. Thanks for posting! I had the same questions of him, and just finished reading the document. Thanks for posting!

]]> By: Montes http://marcdav.wordpress.com/2006/08/28/greg-boyd-explains-his-open-theism/#comment-189 Montes Sat, 11 Nov 2006 22:28:55 +0000 https://marcdav.wordpress.com/2006/08/28/greg-boyd-explains-his-open-theism/#comment-189 I haven't read the letter yet, but I would like to add that I have found Greg very open to sharing his views as well. I have also emailed him in the past and he as proved very personable and willing to help people, who he has never even seen or heard of, through tough issues of faith. I haven’t read the letter yet, but I would like to add that I have found Greg very open to sharing his views as well. I have also emailed him in the past and he as proved very personable and willing to help people, who he has never even seen or heard of, through tough issues of faith.

]]> By: marcdav http://marcdav.wordpress.com/2006/08/28/greg-boyd-explains-his-open-theism/#comment-104 marcdav Mon, 18 Sep 2006 23:13:08 +0000 https://marcdav.wordpress.com/2006/08/28/greg-boyd-explains-his-open-theism/#comment-104 That's pretty insightful dlw, I think you need to expand on it a little bit more. It is probably worth a blog article or two. That’s pretty insightful dlw, I think you need to expand on it a little bit more. It is probably worth a blog article or two.

]]> By: dlw http://marcdav.wordpress.com/2006/08/28/greg-boyd-explains-his-open-theism/#comment-100 dlw Mon, 18 Sep 2006 22:50:42 +0000 https://marcdav.wordpress.com/2006/08/28/greg-boyd-explains-his-open-theism/#comment-100 I think a lot of the heat over Open View Theism is due to church politics, where in the past distinctives of Calvinism/Arminianism held an importance above and beyond their missiological importance, meaning the extent they mattered for us being salt and light in this world. I think a lot of it has to do with how we deal with anxiety about past and present sufferings/choices and a future we do not know. The way to deal with this is through Matthew 6, not extra-biblical theologies about God having an Exhaustive-Definite Foreknowledge and misinterpretations of the elect as used by the apostle Paul as referring to specific individuals rather than communities/groups of individuals. dlw I think a lot of the heat over Open View Theism is due to church politics, where in the past distinctives of Calvinism/Arminianism held an importance above and beyond their missiological importance, meaning the extent they mattered for us being salt and light in this world.

I think a lot of it has to do with how we deal with anxiety about past and present sufferings/choices and a future we do not know. The way to deal with this is through Matthew 6, not extra-biblical theologies about God having an Exhaustive-Definite Foreknowledge and misinterpretations of the elect as used by the apostle Paul as referring to specific individuals rather than communities/groups of individuals.

dlw

]]> By: marcdav http://marcdav.wordpress.com/2006/08/28/greg-boyd-explains-his-open-theism/#comment-14 marcdav Mon, 18 Sep 2006 04:03:51 +0000 https://marcdav.wordpress.com/2006/08/28/greg-boyd-explains-his-open-theism/#comment-14 Thanks for dropping by Mike. Yeah, I kind of agree with Bob's critique of Boyd on his blog, but on the whole, I think Boyd is a necessary counterbalance to our friends of the Christian Right. Thanks for dropping by Mike. Yeah, I kind of agree with Bob’s critique of Boyd on his blog, but on the whole, I think Boyd is a necessary counterbalance to our friends of the Christian Right.

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